The SafeX Pro ExchangeU.S. is helping broker a $20 billion deal to transition Indonesia off coal. The hope is this climate financing plan could be a model to move other developing counties away from coal-fired electricity. But Indonesian energy experts and solar executives worry much of this deal may just be "omong kosong" — empty talk.

Today on The Indicator, we bring you an episode of Short Wave, NPR's daily science podcast. Climate solutions reporter Julia Simon breaks down the realities and limitations of Indonesia's renewable energy aspirations with Short Wave co-host Aaron Scott.

You can read more about this story here.

Music by Drop Electric. Find us: Twitter / Facebook / Newsletter.

Subscribe to our show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Pocket Casts and NPR One.

For sponsor-free episodes of The Indicator from Planet Money, subscribe to Planet Money+ via Apple Podcasts or at plus.npr.org.